158: Five Easy Pieces (1970)

Welcome to the first official episode of the What Are You Watching New Hollywood Film Project, where we examine films of the New Hollywood era, with a primary focus on 1970s classics. 

In this episode, Alex and Nick break down Bob Rafelson’s “Five Easy Pieces.” The guys discuss Rafelson’s career, BBS Productions, a struggling B-movie actor/writer/director named Jack Nicholson, Karen Black, The Monkees, chicken salad sandwiches, and one of the best endings in all of cinema.

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Transcript

0:01

Here we come walking down the street yet funniest walks from everyone we meet. Hey, we're the monkeys. They say we monkey around. But we're too busy singing to put everybody down. Hey, everyone, welcome to. What are you watching? I'm Alex with throne. I'm joined by my best man, Nick, though. So how are you doing there? Pompous, celibate of Jesus Christ. Where did you even get this one? That's what he says to her. What? He's. Oh, yeah. That's right. Like the, you know, the. What are we gonna call her? The, the intellectual. Yes. Yeah. Who's like lay and interpret. So then he lays into her. Great. I, you know, I'm trying to trying to come up with different things sometimes. Not just names apparently. Kind of put another then the other being on it. Yeah. Yeah. Now you're just now you're just saying words. No, I'm just I was just talking out loud. Oh, this is going to be a lot of fun today. Welcome welcome. Welcome everyone. Welcome. We are starting something new today. After much discussion, we've decided to hard launch a brand new film series to the project. Tentatively titled the 70s Film Project. I, in my notes, have been referring to it a little more as the New Hollywood project, because that's New Hollywood Film project, because that's the era we are focusing on. We are going to focus on the new Hollywood movement, primarily of the 1970s. And, you know, by not calling it a 70s film project and just calling it New Hollywood, it means it's kind of exposing some of our general rules already, such as, we're only going to do American films, we're going to focus on each episode is going to be one movie, so we're not going to do like an entire year. We already loosely did this with The French Connection. You could hear us kind of talking about it in that episode. We're like, oh, this could be fun. Like, this could be cool if we picked maybe a movie a year or something. But this episode today, Five Easy Pieces, is our first official, official launch of it. And, you know, one movie from each year we're starting right now, so the conversation doesn't count. Even though we did that, we're still going to do a 1974 film. Yeah. And what will release the titles? Like? I always say, the next episode at the end of every current episode, but I definitely want people to have a chance to see the movies. But we're not going to release like all ten movies. We Nick and I have already agreed what our next ten movies are. 1971 French Connection. That's done 1975 pieces. Right after this. We're recording ours for 1976 and it's just going to be a lot of fun. And I like that we are not going to be picking necessarily the most famous movies from that year. When we get to 1975, it's not going to be jaws, and that's okay. You know, it's not going to be Star Wars either for 77. That's okay. So yeah, I'm really excited for this. Very excited. Dude. This is such a cool idea. Yeah. You can absolutely hear us talk about this in that French connection. Like we were like, like almost just orbiting around an idea that we hadn't really even kind of landed with. It was just sort of like, right, kind of sounds like this would work. One of my favorite things that we're doing today is because of just the way that we're recording these, I'm going to tell the story about how we both came to these movies. Yeah. Please, please, you can spoil our next episode, too. That's fine. Okay. Yeah. So. So the next episode will be, the marathon man. Oh, just marathon man. Marathon man. Oh, my God, the way that we were talking, this was months ago. We were just talking about because I had just. We'll get into like, my, my take on five easy pieces, but I hadn't seen it in a very long time. And it was very, very emotionally moving for me. And so I was just expressing that to you and you're like, man, I haven't I honestly haven't seen this movie since college, I don't think. And I and that was for me too. And so I was like, man, you got to watch this. And now that you've like we've, we've, we're older were wiser like I think there's a new perspective on this and you were all about it. And then you were like, hey, when's the last time you saw Marathon Man? And I go, oh man, I haven't fucking seen that since college. So it's sort of like we we both kind of challenged each other with these movies that we had seen, but had were basically kind of unfamiliar with up until this point. And there was like, we should do it and then give each other's like responses to like what you think about these. And so that's kind of like what we're doing inadvertently. Yeah, that was a while ago that we all behind the scenes were like, all right, we're going to do a double feature like I Alex, I'm gonna watch Five Easy Pieces. And that will be the second time I've seen it. The first time I've seen it in like 20 plus years. Yeah. And then we're going to pilot about it. You're going to do the same thing with Marathon Man, and then we're going to pilot about it. And then, you know, months went by and were mixing the idea around. So it's not like we're going to do that every time. Some of the movies we agreed on, like our 1979 movie you said you hadn't seen, and I went, oh man, this is going to be great. Our 1978 movie, which I made an executive decision on a little bit ago, is, actually most people have seen. So it's, you know, it's going to be and it's not like you haven't seen it recently. I haven't seen it. It's just people kind of have a relationship with it. But that's what makes these two episodes right in a row. Five Easy Pieces and Marathon Man. So good because yeah, I've, I've a much more familiar with Five Easy Pieces now with Rafelson, with PBS, all that stuff. But I wasn't when we committed to this, I wasn't when we recorded the French Connection pod, I was yeah, I am now much more familiar. I'll probably stop with the Marathon man chat now because we will get to that. That was one that I've always been, like, obsessed with. I got to that really young. But you had just seen it once. So now you in the past few weeks have built your own relationship with it. But a few other just points of clarification, it's not like, first of all, we're not going to do these in chronological order. So right now, like we did 71, we're doing 70 and then 76, we're going to do kind of whatever we want, whenever we want. And it's not like these are the next ten episodes we are working on. I've talked about it. We're working on Soderbergh as our next director, so we're chipping away at him. That will come up if if the movie industry gives us a good fucking new movie to see, I'll see it and review it. But come on now, what is this like? I is every new movie I've seen to 2025 and it is dog shit. I went, there's two good movies on here and they're both from the same director presence in Black Bag. Everything else. Like, I mean, I haven't even gone in weeks to the movies and that is so rare for me. But yet, you know, what the hell else are we supposed to talk about? Seriously? Like I'm not. I have no interest in this new slate of stuff. Okay, PETA's coming out. Yeah, that's that's in September. Like, there's there's stuff that I'm interested in that's coming out. I know what you did last summer. I'm excited for that. I don't know if we're going to review it on here, but like, my God, it's a wasteland of new movies. It's so yeah, we're going to throw it back. It's the weirdest first quarter of a year I can honestly remember because, I mean, historically speaking, we're going off on a tangent, but let's go with it is it's fine. It's it's the first quarter of the year is always kind of man like it's it's just not. Yeah. It's this is what it is. But when you like go back and just look at the first four months of this year and just look at the titles of what they are, and it's sort of like, it's not even a matter if they're good or bad. It's just the ideas behind the movies. It's like, what? Who decided that this was a good idea to lean into, and especially at a time where movies are not good. Like not, I don't mean good. I mean movies are not in a good place. Like, we like the landscape of film is so confused. LA has no idea what it's doing. With money, with everything. And you get these titles and no one knows what to do with streaming. And it's like, okay, these are the movies that are getting theatrical releases. And then you look at like, what it's about and you're like, how? How did a, like a meeting room just be like, this is good. Yeah. This is, this is this is our choice. We're moving forward in this direction. And it's like week by week, month by month. I look at like, what's playing? And I go, what is this? Yeah. Like Wolfman I was excited about it sucked present. That's a bummer. Debt. Yeah. Den of thieves two I think the first one is such good like a heat rip off trash. The second one sucked and it ended with an amazing three songs. Best part about the movie flight Risk. We knew that was going to suck, but still. Companion. Stinker. Heart. Eyes. Dumb. Bring Them Down starring two of the best actors of their generation, Christopher Abbott and Barry Keoghan that the movie's huge waste of time. And then Black bag. Those are all the 2025 movies I've seen. I gave I Love Black Bag, I've seen it twice, but I I'm like looking at this, what's the thing right now? Torturing the movie theater employees? Minecraft? The movie. Yeah, people are like trash in theaters. But I just looking at all of that and looking at not a very promising slate of new releases coming up. Yeah, we're going back. And by doing that, we get to talk about, frankly, more movies like, yeah, they're older movies. But I mean, I'm so excited we're going to officially get into Five Easy Pieces now because, my God, like, I knew all I surface level knowledge about all of it. Rafelson I have more than surface level knowledge about Nicholson, but you know, Karen Black long. Wow. This exploration into Rafelson has been my favorite part of researching this podcast. I've now seen every movies directed I love. I mean, I just had no idea about any of this. I'm excited. I know what I'm going to what I have used for the opening track to this, and people are probably like, what the fuck is this? What are these two on? Like, what does this have to do with Five Easy Pieces? I'll explain it, believe me. But let's start with, you know. Yes, general opening, this is how we're going to open these episodes. When did you see first see five pieces. What's your relationship? Been with it since. And then I'm going to describe what I remembered before I rewatched it, which is very little. So yeah, I, I remember watching this movie in college because I was enamored with so many actors of this. This is like the time that I found acting. So I'm watching interviews with, like, Ethan Hawke and Philip Seymour Hoffman, the whole like that. Did you like that? I did, you got it right. I took the time to I did, I had to I can't say that. And these, these, these men were talking about five easy pieces and holding it in such regard. And it wasn't just them. It this was sort of like the movie that the creatives that I was following all expressed deep, deep, admiration and joy for this movie. So I was like, all right, I got to see this. If this is like what everybody's talking about, saw it. And I didn't really know what the fuss was about. Like, that was my honest, like reaction to it. I was like, I don't really know. I'm missing something. I'm like, totally missing something here because it's not bad. I didn't think it was bad, but it was like, I'm not getting this. This, really, really deep sense of something that these other creatives were getting. So then you just fast forward to now I'm 38 and, I've seen some shit. I've been through some shit. Sure. And, man, I'll tell you what, I, I had an experience with this movie that I just got it. And it sucks the way that I got it. Because. Because it just means that, like, it's the, the the level of closed off anger that that Jack Nicholson's character has in this movie is something. When I was younger, I never connected with because I didn't have it. So somewhere down the line, I collected this. And the reason why I meant so much to me was because I was able, I finally was able to relate to something about myself that I didn't even know was there. And I'm like, how I'm getting, I'm understanding. I mean, he's an asshole. Don't get me wrong, like Bobby Deep in this movie, but, but it's just this man who's who's just running from himself in so many ways, and he does not know what to do, like he's running from, he's running from a lot, but he's going nowhere. Going nowhere. And that's the part that like, yeah, cracks me open, man. It is powerful. And it's not something you see like you don't see. Yes. Correct anymore or even in a sense like it's, it's it's a really, really astonishing performance if you let it. And especially at a time where men's stories dominated cinema for so long and, but this was one that I think actually really actually cuts to the core of men in a way that's not just about let's watch another movie about a guy's story. Let's not let's watch another like male trope. This was actually trying to say something about about the human condition through the male experience in this way. And, and I just, I this movie means a lot to me now. And I have not been able to stop watching this movie since I remember I brought it up to you. So. Yeah. Yeah, that's been my experience with it. It's it's really it's really something. So I remember like, when you found it again and you were telling me all this again behind the scenes. Maybe it came up here and there on the pod, but this was one that I, you know, I was into Jack and I loved Cuckoo's Nest. I and I feel like you start with Cuckoo's Nest. Like when you were a young movie. Yeah. Then you discover Chinatown. You're like, oh, you probably have already done The Shining and you know all that stuff. Cuckoo's Nest and it's Chinatown. Then it's like, actually, if you want to see a little earlier, check out The Last Detail, because he's fucking crazy in that. So you start going back and then you arrive at these interviews you're talking about about like, oh, Cuckoo's Nest. Yeah. Chinatown. Wow. Last detail. But I mean, it's fucking five Easy Pieces where the shit starts. It really is. Yeah. He was nominated for supporting actor for Easy Rider, but this is like way different. So I remember hearing that. So I watched it once in college. My big thing that I latched on to was Affleck and Damon. Watch this on repeat for good will hunting tortured genius. Working the blue. The blue collar job. Yeah. He doesn't want who's running from I mean motivations are you know, he Nicholson comes from a family of, like, musical geniuses. Will hunting has no idea where he comes from. He just. He is equipped with this genius. But I saw a lot of that. And then the road movie aspect, it was it was ultimately completely different in every way than I thought it was going to be. Really? Oh, yeah. The first time I saw it, I had no idea was going to be patient. He has a few explosive moments, but he is not. We're not into, you know, our McMurphy at wherever. No. It's like a yeah hysterical flip out. He's much more contemplated. So I'm just saying that's what I remembered from first seeing it. I remember the oil stuff. I remembered a road movie nature of sorts. I was a little off on that. There's just like, you know, a 20 minute road scene. And that was about it. And I remember liking it. So rewatching it for this after we decided, man, like, yeah, it begins and I'm going, okay, getting to know him. Like I see how everything's going on. But when I'm just going to jump to and again, like, we're more than 20 minutes into this episode, but I do want people to see these movies we are going to I'm not going to like another difference with these reviews is we're not going to go line by line, like minute by minute. Yeah, each thing, they're going to be a little more broad. But we are going to talk about the endings. Well, I'll try to be general, but sometimes you're going to be specific. So switching back to Nick when he got out of that fucking car and is in that bathroom and he looks at that himself and that, oh my God, that shot is just so evocative I can draw. So yeah, right now, the colors, his facial expression, which I don't even know how to put into words. I don't know what he's doing with his face. It's a blankness. It's a decision or lack thereof. And then, I mean, we're really like three shots away. He leaves. We get the kind of a closer shot where he's talking, making a deal with the truck driver, and that fucking truck takes off and portray it, and then it's credits and I'm getting chills talking about it. And it is. That is of course, of course, of course. This movie we're going to talk about it is known primarily for one scene. It's about 90s long. It doesn't have much else to do with the movie. It's a great scene that has to do, you know, with toast and a chicken salad sandwich, that ending those three final shots. Or you can read Ebert's reviews about it. We're people at the at the festivals, like at the New York Festival where no one moved. They couldn't move in there. Like what? That. That's it. What? What happens? Like, Bobby doesn't know what's going to happen. How the hell can we like. Oh, man. So I was really, really moved by it, to be honest. And then I went. Now the exploration begins because I started here and then I went back to Rafelson repeat viewings of the film. So yeah, it has been a lot of fun. And this is just the as we define like 70 cinema. It actually kind of started with Bonnie and Clyde because it started when the Hays Code was done. So 67 is when they can start doing this. Bonnie and Clyde The Graduate. But then it's really midnight Cowboy is like, Holy shit, we're not messing around. It's here. That is the year before Five Easy Pieces wins best Picture. There's nothing in five Easy Pieces that's as radical as what's in Midnight Cowboy. But it's it's that ending that you're going for. This guy is not a hero. Bobby is not a hero. He's an asshole, like you said. Like, how are we supposed to root for him? Or who will we rooting for? And then he's so aimless and you're like, wow, it just damn if it didn't, if it doesn't make you think you just. I sat back and just had a fucking thought, man. I like, sat there, gone, wow, wow. So it's really something. This is a great, great film. It's absolutely stirring that ending. Yeah. It's just it's shocking every time you see it because man. Yeah, you're exactly right. Like the thing that it does that it didn't do in Hollywood back then is. It doesn't give us a resolution. Know. And it it's not even an ending. It's not it's there's nothing good to feel, but there's a stark reality to the slap in the face of what you think about as you sit there and watch the credits roll, because you're left with a decision that this character that we've been watching for like two hours is made. That is not a decision that movies make. Like you, don't you don't give that ending. And to be able at that. Now you just realized that to me, that's one of the best endings in all of film. I absolutely agree, and I did not remember that before researching this episode. And I absolutely agree 100%, because you are left with a whole entire world. There's this idea that I love that, the most interesting scene that could ever happen in the movie is like, what? You don't see the one you create? Yeah, the one you create. Yeah. And so like, really, when you think about it, it's like you can start anywhere, like because you ask all these questions to yourself, well, where is he going to go? What's it going to do. What's going to happen when they reunite and you're putting together a whole other movie right before you, but you don't get it, and it's and you're just left with this also just completely horrible move. Like, what a what an awful thing for this other human being to do to to somebody else. Yeah. There's just so much it's honestly like it makes me think of the Nora in that way because. Oh, sure. Oh, yeah. Because you're left with so many questions that matter to like that like to the soul and, and and it's all you. It's just whatever you want to make of it, but it it's it just punches you in the face. It's so great. Well, this is why I kept saying it's like a 70s movie. It's like it's I mean, even. Yes, I'm doing it again. I'm talking about the next movie, but the next movie we're talking about has the first half. It's like weeks or months or passing by, and the second half is one day, which is exactly like a Nora. It's like that. This is what I'm saying. It followed much more the conventions of a 70s movie. And Nora did, I will not let Nora die. It'll be mentioned on every part that's like, absolutely have some fucking love. I don't know, you know, the film in general is about Five Easy Pieces is about this guy. We meet this guy, Bobby Dupree, who works in Bakersfield, California, on the on the oil oil drills there. And we're just kind of, you know, he's got he's got a buddy that he works with. He's got a lady who kind of annoys him. He has a way of talking down to everyone like, yeah, he's just like this aimless guy. Like he'll go, you know, he goes bowling and he drinks and he sleeps around on his lady, and it's it that's like the kind of nature of it. But then he is, who he meets up with. His sister, who motivates him to, you know, maybe he should go back home because there's some family stuff going on. So he's going to drive north to Washington State. And what happens when he gets home that is like the crew is set up with a movie I can get. But yeah, if you're listening to this and you haven't, you know, you have no idea what it's about. That's what that's the basic like bare bones logline of it. But, you know, the movie was created by Bob Rafelson, a legendary director, American director of these types of movies. And I had seen some Rafelson movies. I'd seen, you know, him and Jack worked together a lot. I'd seen The Postman Always Rings Twice. Yeah, his remake of that. I saw Pacific Heights. No. Damn it, see him doing fucking Marathon Man again? I'm getting confused. Yeah, I was a fan of Rafelson. But then, you know, I want to talk about this Bob's films because he starts this company with Bert Schneider and this other guy, and they call it. It was called Something Else. First it was called Ray Bert Productions, and then that gets made into PBS and they make a series of films that are, you know, known as mainstay Days of 70 cinema. And I had not seen any of these before researching this, but it's been a that has been a lot of part of the fun of going back and watching all this stuff. So I do I want to talk about these movies, but have you watched these Bob's films? Have you had time to check any of them out? I haven't, I haven't I? It's funny, I have the box set by criterion. I haven't had a chance to check many of them out, but I've seen the documentary and it's a really great documentary on it. Yeah. So I'm and I but I've seen like the last Picture Show. I've seen Easy Rider. Yeah, yeah. But they are the ones that are in between. It's mostly the jack ones, like. So. Yeah. Can't wait to see the King of Marvin Gardens because that's, that's you know. Yeah. So I, I was so I watched them all for this all this pbs of so they started with had this movie made 1968 and I put it on it's on good old to be there put it on. And I'm like, what the fuck is this like it's his first movie. And I'll tell you, this is one of the most surreal Wikipedia deep times I've had because I'm watching had co-written by Jack Nicholson. And I'm going, okay, this is like the monkeys. I know the band, the monkeys. I love this band. When I was a kid, and they're running around and it feels like Spinal Tap. Two decades before Spinal Tap feels like A Hard Day's Night, where the Beatles are kind of playing themselves. It's it's insane. It's crazy. They're cutting to, like, real footage from Vietnam of, you know, people getting killed. And I'm like, what the hell? What is this? But then it's so satirical and hilarious. I'm just dying laughing. So after I hop on Wikipedia and I'm like, and here comes the mind blown part, Bob Rafelson, the director, created the television show The Monkeys and therefore created the band The Monkeys. They became a sensation from that TV show. And I that that was a band I was obsessed with when I was a kid. My dad loved the monkeys. My mom did. So to know that, like everyone does, the fucking director of Five Pieces founded the Monkeys. Like what I didn't I it was so like mine, but. And Jack Nicholson had a hand in this, like, what the hell is. So I mean, that is why I'm going to love this. Why do Hollywood film project? Because that I was not on my bingo card at all. So we could just start there, that I'm like, This all happened. So highly recommend head. But yeah, that was a and I'm recommending it to you too. But that is so funny that he makes head and then five easy pieces. So this is a dude with a extremely sharp sense of humor. Bob Richardson is we already knew Jack was he's a, you know, evil little fucker. But yeah, so is Rafelson. And I love it. I love it, I love there's so many good conversations that, in interviews where Jack and Bob talk about each other and just being writing partners, the. It's such an open relationship. They talk about themselves like they would fight, they would laugh, they would go through everything. And but he goes, but no matter what he goes, I would yell at them and then tell them, this is awful or this is that. But they we always have dinner like we would never we would never, like, get so upset that you guys, no matter how this creative process was going, you goes, we're going to have dinner together. And they just talk so lovingly about their friendship and their creative partnership. It's so and you think about like what it was at that time and it's no different than. No, like, these were all guys that were trying to find their way into an industry that seemingly didn't want them. And it's crazy to think that because Jack Nicholson, Jack Nicholson spent ten years of Hollywood basically being like, no, we don't like bumming around in, yeah, bad movies, bad parts. He wanted to be a writer director. That was his aim. And yeah, and then he Easy Rider. I forget who was cast in that part, but he dropped out and Jack was a last minute replacement, and that's what gets him on the scene. And Easy Rider was the second film produced by BBS productions, directed by Dennis Hopper. But yeah, it had is 68. Easy rider 69. So you see this? It's this group coming together. Jack talks about that early part of his career and he, you know, as frustrated as he was with like whatever this career was, being this, these B-movie parts, he talks about how he would use this time to because nowadays, like if you're an actor, you can audition on your camera, like you could actually figure out how you are, like, what essence you bring that captivates. He was doing all of this on the job. He looked at all of this time as a way to kind of figure out what he brings to the camera or to the audience in that way. And he says that if he didn't spend all that time doing that, when that opportunity came for Easy Rider, because what he does in Easy Rider, I mean, it's really hard to say what your favorite Jack Nicholson performance is. And Easy Rider to me is like in that conversation. I love him in it, but he knew who he was and he knew what he brought to the table. That wasn't what the industry was doing. But if he didn't spend all that time bumming around in these B-movies because that's what he was getting, and then having a bigger idea ahead of him of what he could be if he didn't do any of that. And then Easy Rider came. He might not have that. We might not get that performance. So it's it's a really cool insight to to somebody that everyone talks about. Oh ten years. He, he did a bunch of nothing, but he ended up figuring out what he was and who he was. And then when the opportunity came, he was prepared and ready for it. And then off to the races we go. Yeah, exactly. It's like, that's the opportunity meeting, like good fortune, all that stuff. And yeah, he he wasn't launched out of a cannon like, oh he's some set hand who. Let's give him a part in Easy Rider. He was trying and he was on set. He was like building his network. But yeah, no one with all these a lot of these movies, we're going to talk about when they started their careers, no one wanted them. No one wanted Five Easy Pieces or Nicholson or none of this. They did it themselves. I want to wrap up here. Here's there. So Ography didn't Rafelson did not direct all these movies. But this is everything that that production company released in a very short time. Yeah. Head Easy Rider dry, he said. Directed by Jack Nicholson. The Last Picture Show A Safe Place, which is directed by one of the editors of Easy Rider and The King of Marvin Gardens. I did watch them all for this. Had a lot of fun doing that. We can talk. I'll talk about it maybe as we go. And then I also don't want to, you know, Bert Schneider, who was NBS, was no slouch either. He made a documentary called Hearts and Minds, which is one of the. Wow, it's one of the most unforgettable things you'll ever see. It won the Oscar. It's about the Vietnam War as Vietnam was still going on. And that footage used in the head of that man getting shot on the street is used in hearts and minds. And so you see how all this stuff is connected. So Rafelson and Schneider, like, they didn't fuck around. They were here to tell serious stories, whether narrative or documentary. Yeah, they had something to say. They absolutely had something to say. Yes. Yes, absolutely. So that's I mean, that's what brings Nicholson up to five easy Pieces. We kind of just naturally were talking about him, that he didn't come from nowhere. I've gone and chipped away. I'm not I haven't watched every movies. And I mean go on his IMDb. Like he's in a lot of movies for that decade prior, and they're not good and they're not trying to be good. They're Roger Corman B-movie. It's like we're saying, but then getting that part in Easy Rider, Easy Rider, another one I'd seen once in actually pre college and rewatched it for this and was like, you know, oh man, it's just so the thing that you, it's kind of like what we said when you started Five Easy Pieces, you're like, oh, what's the fuss about? But part of the reason we're doing this film series is the context of it all. No one had seen shit like that. They're doing coke and like the first scene and then just the the trippy nature of it in the editing, they don't do. I thought they did it all the time, but to get from one scene to the next jump to show like frames, Ford jumps to it. Yeah, but it's really I mean, sorry about the end of five pieces. Holy shit. That end Easy Rider is just you're like, it's a huge you know, I know it's all a metaphor, but it's just this giant literal fuck you to them as they're trying to make this movie like the old, like, rednecks represent the powers that be in Hollywood, and they're just shooting these guys down. They can't do it. Doesn't matter if one of them is the son of one of the most famous and well respected actors ever, Henry Fonda doesn't matter. Like they're no one's letting them do anything. And then also, like, the fucking music is so good. Oh, no. It's been used and reused and reused so much, even in The Big Chill, like a movie I adore and a soundtrack I adore. But and it's just them. They play the full songs out just of their driving and yeah, I love it. So I love that it has a very an energy of like, we don't give a fuck, we're renegades. We're doing this on our own if we have to, I don't care. Five Easy Pieces is a little more controlled than Eddie Easy Riser, Easy Rider, but it still has that energy just in the characterization of Jack. It absolutely does. Their, The one thing I never really thought about was when you talk about that era of time, watching the watching the commentary for Five Easy Pieces, his ex-wife, the production designer, she's a part of the commentary. And she often, when she would come in on the track, would talk about why this meant something at the time. And there was because Easy Rider, it's really easy to look at Easy Rider and be like, oh, this is like the counterculture. This is like the hippies. And of course, like that's that's a big part of it. But the feeling that she was after in Five Easy Pieces was this lost feeling. She's like, America did not know what it was, and there was no one telling us where to go and where we ended up finding any kind of identity for ourselves was not there. We were searching for something that we one didn't know what it was, and ultimately we never got. Because then you enter into Nixon and all of this and it's like the, the, the, the American dream really did die. Yeah. Because yeah, that's exactly and and but can you imagine I mean, you think about the times we're living in right now, like it's very hard to pinpoint where we are in this country as a, as a cultural society. It does feel like something is happening or gone or whatever it is. But this was what was going on then. And, and to look at this movie now from that, not that the movie was trying to really make a statement about that, but it lives there. It absolutely was. And because you see, like, this guy's just lost and even all the other characters around him are kind of lost in this way. Yeah. Very fascinating. I think a lot of that was born from the culture. Yeah. At the time. Like where do these people go? And on top of it, there's a fucking war going on that a lot of people don't think, yeah, we should. America should be involved in and like, men can get shipped off at any moment. So yeah, that the work is coming from a reaction to that. And for the really the only time in film in American film history, this 76 six, this 67, 68 to about like we can it's basically like 1980. That was the only time that studios, major studios that are still around today, Columbia, universal, MGM were giving directors creative control like creative control. They were letting them make decisions and by no fault of their own, two guys, Spielberg with Jaws and Lucas with star Wars went proved everyone. Holy shit, we can make a fucking killing off of these things. It can be about art, but it can kind of more so be about commerce. So then that was it was a perfect storm in the late 60s, something like, oh, the the Hays Code is gone. And we have this young emerging talent and they're going to let us make the decisions. And then less than a decade later, there was a perfect storm of holy shit studio heads realized, this can make money. All right, let's take him back so we can make money. And we need a scapegoat because this is still working creatively. Heaven's gate. Boom! The Oscar winner of The Deer Hunter got a shitload of money from United Artists. Went and made this movie. That is not a bad movie at all, but it fucking bombed and it bankrupted the studio. So fuck, these kids were taken creative control back. Yeah. And that's that's this whole scope that we're talking about here. And yes, movies like Easy Rider, movies like Five Easy Pieces are a direct counter. I mean, with five Easy Pieces, we could start getting into the film now itself because, you know, we have like 45 minutes in Bakersfield. But then as soon as we're in that car, we meet Helena, a fat woman who I just love. Oh my God, so much. In seven minutes of her and her, Oliver ran to about consumerism. Like, fuck that. You don't want to do that. I mean, she even literally looks at the screen. It looks into the camera rather. What? Boyd goes, I don't even want to talk about it. And she's like, that is that's an even metaphor like that, that it's text. It's that subtext right there, like fuck consumerism. Fuck yes, I just I love it, but, yeah, let's open it up to like the first half of the film. Bakersfield, all that section. What are you liking and what do you like it? What do you like it? I mean, we meet this guy, and I love Beatty. It's so rare to an antihero is like Travis Bickle. Okay? That dude is capable of really homicidal shit. But, you know, you don't know that for the whole thing, but it it's easy to make a decision about him, you know, one way or another with Nicholson right away, you're like, damn, this dude is just. You don't treat anyone well like he's just an asshole. Let's go bowling. And then she can't. She's not good. His girlfriend is not good. It's so sad. Or it dies in the gutter. Isn't it wonderful? Like you said, it's just hilarious. I love him in it. God, he's. But that's it. We're. You know, it's, it's a tone piece we're getting. We're meeting Bobby. That's what it is in the world around him. I mean, as soon as it starts, like, the one of the first things that we understand is that he doesn't say I love you. Like he like he what? He what? We meet this guy in an oil rig, he's driving home, gets to a house, walks in, and there's a girl, and he walks in there with just such a like the interesting thing is, I don't ever think for one second that Bobby doesn't appreciate Ray yet. I never think that I agree. It's just that he he just can't give himself like he can't trust himself. It seems like to just very insecure. Yeah, yeah. And here is this love. Pure love from this woman coming at him completely. Almost like unconditionally. Like it's like I, it's he's the only honest person in the movie. And she is like, because. Yeah, what she says is how she is. There's no bullshit to her. She is not full of shit. She might be annoying and obnoxious, but yeah, she loves him. She loves as simple as that. Yeah. And and all. She's trying to do is just to is just to show Jack Nicholson, Bobby that, like, I'm here for you and he can't accept it. And so that by just simply the opening before we go anywhere that we know that she's like, I just want you to say it like I just I forget what the exact words were, but she's like, I'll do anything, I'll do it or everything. If you just say those three words and he just disassociate from it and, and it's in his body language. So we immediately know from the very first scene that this guy is just he's, he's he's hiding. And then we see the way it takes out in the bowling alley. Yep. Is it it's that like, there's something like that's just irking him. Like he just like it's. Oh, God. And then he's thrown by these two other people. Oh, there's a really great moment with paying attention to the sound in this movie is actually pretty incredible. Because there's moments that it's like it's doesn't kind of strike you as a movie where it's like, oh, the sound design is just like in a, this is like an a movie to watch for sound. But there's so many moments that are done that are just incredible. And that one of them is, is that once every the friends leave, he's sitting in the bowling alley, the sound dips out and he's left with that were in his head space and he's just consulted his girlfriend. His friends seen it, they have their opinion about it, and now he's left by himself. And you can see like this machinery inside of him just not knowing what to do. So the sound goes out until two other people, strangers, these two women enter. And now and now on. Maybe a flirts on. And it's a great scene. I mean, and and we're getting his humor, but like, just to know, like what would have happened if they didn't show up like, he like he would still would have been lost in his. It's this, this distraction that comes his way. That's why he likes it so much, is like, oh yeah, oh, here's it. It's not even just the women that could have been. That could have been anything but have been like, oh, here's a chance for me to not think about what I was thinking about. Yeah. His most like telling one of his most telling characteristics to me is that he we come to learn. We may not know right away. Well, we come to learn. He's an incredibly intelligent person. He just is. He's a yes. He's a very smart person. Musical genius. Musical prodigy comes from a family of them. What does it say of him that he intentionally hangs out with people that are that he considers intellectually inferior? Like, you know, he's not out there trying to date a road scholar or another famous musician. It's he's keeping friends and keeping company with these people on purpose so that there can be this sort of like emotional stasis, which, again, is something I think we see in goodwill hunting in the Minnie Driver character. And that is not unlike what Catherine will come to represent for him. It's like this. Oh, there can be this intellectual beauty type thing. And they also share the trait of being assholes, but that's, you know, just another thing they have in common. I love, I think, our first real iconic scene of the film of Five Easy Pieces is being stuck in traffic. And, you know, they're taking the hops from the drinks, and he sees in the back of a truck there's a piano, an old piano that's covered, and it's just a great scene of 70 cinema, when Jack jumps in the back of this pickup truck and uncovers the piano and starts playing it. And then as the truck drives off in a different direction that he is going, he just stays with it and keeps on playing and it drops him off nowhere. Who knows where. And that is kind of this guy's life. Like I it's just one thing to the next. There doesn't seem to be a big whole lot of planning involved. And it's just a it's a short scene that really tells you a lot about him. And it's iconic, that image of him in the back, I mean, it's the fucking poster of the movie is the Boat. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. You want to flash your lights as we can see. What else you got for Christmas? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You going? Oh. Oh, yeah. When we all lined up like a goddamn bunch. It's the most beautiful part of the day. And it's. Like. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. The metaphor for that scene in the screenwriting, I think is brilliant. It because, like, right before he gets on there where he's stuck in traffic and in the car, like he can't take it, he can't. He's literally like he's he's having this road rage reaction to just simply like morning traffic.

They're drinking at 7: 45:09

00 am to I love that. It's of course, of course, but and he's just like, God damn, it's, you know, what is all this? How do people supposed to live their lives? And what you realize is that, like, this is this guy's internal, like, this is what he that's how he's actually feeling. He's stuck in his life. He's not going anywhere. And now that he's actually in a real situation where that's mirroring him, he he he explodes, jumps out of the car, is yelling at the other traffic, barking at the dog. It's a complete it's chaos. And then he sees a piano, and it's the one thing that he knows that's actually true about himself is that he knows that he is good at this and this is actually probably the direction he should take his life. But the only time he could ever, ever bring himself to even remotely play a piano is because this is the only thing that's here. Yeah, his frustration is boiled over so much that the only thing he can do is the thing that's actually mean something to him, that other than that, he can't do it. He he'll never. Yeah, he plays the piano eventually for the one girl, but he does it with no emotion, with no emotion. And he does it as like a fuck you. This piano was for him. That on the traffic. That's him. Like living his life. Because whatever he plays, the piano is out of tune and everything like that. But that's meant to show his talent and. And no one's going to hear it. No one's going to see it. But it takes him out of the frustration that's in his head. It's it's a brilliant metaphor written for his screenplay. I it's it's so good. And I love that when he, when the car goes off, like I love that we see that he just drops in some town. Yeah. Just wandering. Thanks. Yeah. It's like, thanks for dropping me off. Yeah. I actually thought they were knocking off of work. Not going to work, because when he gets dropped off, it's like sunset. But I spent an inordinate amount of time being like, are they going to work or is that from work? Because he he keeps saying they try to waste the best hours of our day. And I thought he meant like, you know, this is our time to be at home, like relax and not in traffic. But either way, yeah, the the most telling thing is that we just get dropped off like an idiot out on a corner. He's like, thanks. And he's okay with, oh, he he is content to be a wanderer. Sure. But we should also say plot wise, something has happened that his buddy Elton, who you know will pick up girls with Jack on the side to the bowling girls, has informed him that his darling Red, that Jack treats Jack. Bobby, I'm using them interchangeably. Yeah, yeah, treats with such dignity and kindness is indeed pregnant. So he has that information. Bobby now is possessing that information and it's kind of getting scared and just packs up and takes old, takes a little day trip to LA. I had no recollection that his sister in this was played by Aunt Meg from twister, Lois Smith. How great to see my wife's side. Yeah. So, yeah. Goodness, she's so good. And this is the. I love just driving. I mean, seeing, you know LA and like the Hollywood Bowl and it looks so it looks so the same. And I love just seeing that stuff. And that's a great scene that they have. And you know it's the whole dad's sick. I think you should I know you haven't been home in a while, but I think you need to come drive on up and see dad, because who knows how it's going to be. And then he goes and tells Ray at this, who is not happy about it, and almost insinuates that maybe she won't be around, like, you know, in the world if he does this. So he invites her long and here we go on the road. It's just great. It's a great set up to, you know, there's this isn't a plot heavy movie, but he has a reason to be on the road and. All right, fine. Now I got to take her along. It's fine. And before we talk, I love what he does with Ray when they get to where they're going. But we had some standout scenes in the middle to talk about that. We just heard the motel. I mean, that's I mean, you get that. It's that iconic. Christ, I love that line where he's like telling her because he, like, brought her to the hotel, but then he's leaving her there. So anyway, yeah, you know, and and he does this one thing where he's like, explain to his like, listen, I don't want to do this like and like I need to feel out, like I need to get the lay of the land. Basically what he's saying. Yeah. And he and he goes in Jesus Christ, you ought to know me better than that. You just ask like this. Like, like. Oh, it's so funny. Oh my God. There's a there's also like, one really great Jack moment that he has when he's with the him and Eleanor with the two bowling girls and like. Yeah, clearly like they're having like they're cheating on their, their girlfriends, they're naked, they're in their underwear. They're like, you know, talking and, God, what's the actress's name? Sally Struthers. Is that who. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's right, that's right. She's got this great little moment where she tells this really great monologue, all improvised about how, because she's got a dimple on her chin and. Oh, yeah. And it's like, basically, it's like when you're being born in the factory, you know, God is like putting his blessing on their people by, like, touching their cheeks and giving them the dimples. And then if he doesn't like you, it's pushing the index finger on your chin, like, go away. Yeah, yeah. And it's actually a, like, a very sad, moment. But she brings down the vibe of the party, and you see Jack's face. He looks at her as she's telling the story. He's like, are you fucking kidding me? Like you're going to ruin the fucking party. And then all of a sudden it gets later and he goes, yeah, here we go. But there's this one moment, there he goes, he goes, I can't believe we're doing this right now. God. Jack, I love because he knows he's about to go to before they mark on the road trip. He just goes in there and the delivery is so flat, monotone. He's just sort of like, I'm going to be gone for this. I don't know what I'm. I don't know how it's going to go. This is it. It's just this. And she's crying. She's. And he's just sort of it's like there's just no emotion. And then he has that awesome freak out in the car. Yeah. And then he. And then he just walks back in. He goes, do you want to come with me? And and it's like, that's just him wrestling with the fact that he actually I think he actually does love her. Just and but this is this is how hard it is. This is how hard it is for him. I think he cares about her. Not like chiefly because she's around and she's in proximity. Soon as he's about to meet his brother's fiancee. No regard to that. But as soon as that, it's like, read who? So it's whoever he can. But I mean, is was a relationship between him and Katherine going to work out? Are we joking? No. She sees right through him. You know what she says? That's what's great in his place at the end. Yeah. It's like it's. Oh, God, it's beautiful and we'll get there. But yeah, they're on the road. Him right. And they pick up, you know, I mean, one thing I got to pause for a little bit here is the cinematography by Laszlo Kovacs, which is like these colors are popping out of us when he's talking to Ray at outside the bowling alley. The color, I mean. And then when they hit the road, the vistas, the green fields, sunset, the like, it's just it's gorgeous. They pick up two women. Yeah. Palm and Terry and Palms, the one who's just full of these opinions and basically rant and rave. And she's going to move to Alaska because it's cleaner. He's never going to see what crap people's homes are filth. People are filthy. I mean, that wouldn't be filthy with Coke bottles and whiskey and, those signs everywhere they should be. You're right. Dollar signs, all your crap and more crap and more crap that I mean, I don't I don't even want to talk about it. Well, it's just filthy. People are filthy. I think that's the biggest thing that's wrong with people. I think they wouldn't be as violent if they were clean, because then they wouldn't have anybody to pick on dirt. What does it say? Dirt is bad. It's filth. Filth is bad. That's what starts maggots and riots. People that truck into the best places to stop. And then kind of out of nowhere, we are dropped into a diner and for one minute and 40s five easy pieces makes cinematic history. Yeah, and I don't think you can know that you're doing this when you're doing it. The shower scene in psycho. Yeah, you're probably going for greatness. There's so many cuts. There's so many setups, the scores so deliberate. You're talking to me in Taxi Driver. They didn't know what they had. Chicken salad sandwich in Five Easy Pieces. They didn't know what they had. And it's fascinating to watch this because I, I told friends of mine who were not movie people that we were going to be podcasting about this, and they type in five, five easy pieces into Google. Yeah. And the diners image is the first thing and they're like, oh, I've seen this before. And it's so like that image of Nicholson with the jacket sitting in the diner, the composition of the camera, everyone knows it. It's just such a famous. Yeah. And of course, the film is now known because of this and defined in some reason by it. And it's just one of the great ironies of the movie that it doesn't have much to do with the movie. It really has nothing to do with presentation of the movie. It's just a character thing. It was, it was a compilation of how Bob Rafelson, in real life always asked for these adjustments to his meals, and Nicholson in real life, once or maybe a few times, cleared the table that way in frustration. So they mix it together. And it is is just one of the most iconic scenes ever. And I loved it. Every chance Rafelson gets. What I was watching interviews, he's like, yeah, but it's just a shame that the movie's defined by this because it's not. This isn't what the movie's about. And I get that I do, but I'm coming. Yeah, I'm coming from a place where my favorite film of all time is defined by just a few words. You talking to me? And everyone knows that scene. And that I will argue, though, that that fits a little better into the narrative of Taxi Driver, whereas this is just like it's it's amazing to me that a character scene is this well known, but it's also it's also stunning how short it is. I always forget that. I'm like, you're we're an hour, one minute 40s I count it. Yeah. And it's a good example because I agree. Like, I, I remember we were texting about this because I was like, man, this is just not what this movie actually is like. Yeah, this diner scene. But you also don't know that when you're making it that this is going to become an iconic scene in movie history. And it's also one of those ones too, where if you know that it's not, if you think if you don't know that it's going to become that, it begs the question, why are we leaving this in? Because like Taxi Driver, like, that scene actually does have a narrative purpose because we're getting in his headspace like he's just slowly more and more like just isolating and deepening into madness. This does not belong at all. Like the road. Like if you if you take the road trip whole sequence, that makes sense because we have to get from LA up to this area of the country. So we got to get there. So we just take this road trip. The girls are a nice little addition, but this diner scene serves absolutely no purpose. And I love this idea that it's sort of like when you're making that movie and you're like, yeah, let's have this scene in there and someone tells you, hey, we, this thing doesn't serve a purpose. We got to cut it now, keep keeping it. Yeah. And and then then that's where it becomes. So it's it's one of those things where I think you just have to always kind of ask yourself if you're creating something, especially if it feels right. I remember this happened. Was there I go I remember we got it. I got a note that someone said to cut out the entire jazz scene, the entire jazz scene. And and because it serves no narrative purpose and I just was like, but then we don't have it then, like, then we don't have, like, everything I love about this. What's the point if I just hit beats? Yeah. If movies are just about narrative, then that's what like formula plot, action movies are for like that's where for ABC like go yeah, go do that. But this is one of the reasons why we're starting this series and we love this so much, is that a lot of these movies threw the shit out and they. Yeah, exactly. We can make room for this. And to them, it was probably just all a gag to make themselves laugh like Bob. Jack. They do this all the time at restaurants, and then there may be some resentment involved from the people who made the movie about like, this is what it's known for. Bands of the same thing. A lot of bands are just, oh yeah, some song or something. So but at least, at least you are known. At least you have a minute and 40 seconds. That is in the cinematic lexicon. It's in the zeitgeist. Yeah. You made a very good point. The last detail does not have anything like this. That's a great film. It doesn't have this. It doesn't have that one thing. I mean, and, you know, you can you can pull out these scenes. It's the Oscar reel scenes. You see, this movie we're doing has a really famous one. It's how I initially saw the movie, because I saw Laurence Olivier with his hand full of Dustin Hoffman's mouth and Dustin Hoffman screaming in pain, and I went, what the fuck is that? I have to see that. I saw a grown man punching a horse and knocking it out. And I went, dad, what is that? My dad's laughing in the corner. He's like, it's it's a movie called Blazing Saddles. And I go, I got to see it. You got to show it to me. Attica! Attica! Pacino! Attica! In Dog Day, like, these scenes punch through, you know, and it's it's just cool when you come across one of these iconic scenes. Why is it iconic? Who the hell knows? It just is. And it still is a marvelously entertaining. So yeah. Yeah, that's serve or, you know, chicken salad. Sam. Whole chicken like I'd love for it. And then have like, I want you to put it between your knees. Just him playing off it and then hell it out of the corner like, hey Mac or whatever. She always said, I love what he's going did. He goes, shut up. And he doesn't even know. Or like, he's like, they just met. Shut up. So good. I'd like a plain omelet. No potatoes on the plate, a cup of coffee and a side order of wheat toast. I'm sorry. We don't have any side orders of toast out of the blue. English muffin or a coffee roll. What do you mean? You don't make side orders of toast? You make sandwiches, don't you? Would you like to talk to the manager? Hey, Mac. Shut up. You've got bread and a toaster of some kind. I don't make the rules. Okay? I'll make it as easy for you as I can. I'd like an omelet plain and a chicken salad sandwich on wheat toast. No mayonnaise, no butter, no lettuce and a cup of coffee. And number two, chicken salad. Send all the butter, the lettuce, the mayonnaise and a cup of coffee. Anything else? Yeah. Now all you have to do is hold the chicken. Bring me the toast. Give me a check for the chicken salad sandwich. And you haven't broken any rules. You want me to hold the chicken, I want you to hold it between your knees. It's a great point to, like, hold. Yeah, I mean, you got. What do you mean? You don't have to, like. It's. Yeah. I love that stuff. When you buck up against a person of no like that, it's like. All right, let me explain. The studio. Yeah. And he's. And he's out. Honestly. And the funny thing is, is, like, for that type of character, he's actually quite gentle. And the whole entire time he's like, yeah, he he waits to explode. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. And then. It's so good. Salad. God. It's the best. Yeah. So. And then after the diner scene, they're still going. They dropped the ladies off at that. He don't yet at a motel because he's too embarrassed to take her up to his, you know, intellectual, stuffy family of sorts. I mean, we met the sister. She's all right, guys, I, I that's one of my favorite relationships in the entire movie is Jack and his sister. I think that's something like it's so lived in, but there's just something so sweet. Even when he meets her at the piano, it's. They're genuinely happy to see each other like that is a brother sister that is sort of like. I like it especially for her. She she wears it all on her sleeve. She loves her brother Bobby, and you see him like he's just got the softest spot for her in his way. But he even still keeps her at that distance. Like. Oh, sure. Like, oh, sure. Yeah. He's not going to let her in as much as she wants to. But yeah, keep going, keep going. Well, yeah, I love that he has to take the ferry home. It's just it's that last step of, like, God, I have to travel far to go to this fucking place. Like it's just. Yeah. And, and the imagery, like, it looks great. Like it. He looks so cold and miserable. He done that for you? Like, it really fits. Yes, I love that. I love that you're exactly right. Like it's that last awful step that you don't even want to do this year. Yeah. Damn it, here we go. But I mean, I also I get, I honestly like I get, when he left her there at the hotel, it's not a nice thing to do, but, like, I mean, I didn't bring my girlfriend, my ex-girlfriend home ever. You guys. Yeah, I get it. Because he's, thinking ahead. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. It's like, it's just. I don't know, man. There's just so much here that I just like. And you're starting to understand about myself that I was like, God damn it. There's a lot I relate to. Looking at a beer. Yeah, yeah. He goes home, he goes. So we get to meet some interesting characters. His brother Carl, played by Ralph. Wait, do you know who this guy is? No. Do you know who this fucking guy is? This is Frank, old man Frank from cliffhanger. This man never hurt anybody. Oh, my. Greg, I love Frank and cliffhanger. I was looking at this dude's eyes and I'm. I'm going. I know this guy. Who the hell is this guy? You know what? He's of course, but at other things. But I grew up obsessed with cliffhanger when I made that connection, it was great. His next all jacked up from an injury. He's got a fiancée, Catherine, who Bobby clearly fancies. Her dad can't move or talk. He's in rough shape. I got a weightlifting nurse, and I mean, just right away. He goes in on Catherine and start flirting with her because, you know, he wants to. He has no concern for the pregnant girlfriend he has stashed in the motel. Or the fact that Catherine is engaged to his brother. It's just, you know, it. It's it's great. Yeah. It is. Yeah. And and it's and it's all because in his life, there's no other new avenue, like. Yeah, there's. She is the only actual exit that's presented. Otherwise it's the same girlfriend that he has. He's back home, which he hates. His job with the oil rig. His friend Elton is is in jail, which. That's right. Yeah. He's got punched. Yeah, yeah, he got pinched. And a great scene too I love that. Yeah. When he runs because they've just had a little like argument. But then he sees like two dudes in suits roughing up his buddies and he sprints to them. I love that he punches out one of the agents and Elton's like, come on, if you knew. If he knew you were an agent, he never would have hit you. And Nelson's like, Like, all right, let's go on. And they let him go. Yeah, it's a great scene. Yeah, it's a great scene. And again, just really quick go into that scene. The sound because oh yeah, they just get into a fight. And I love that actor who plays Elton. He reminds me of a really good friend of mine I, I every time. Yeah they have the exact same kind of like I mean this with all the love. But Elton has like that. Just kind of like dumb guy though. Like he lives. Who's that kind of deal? My friend has this, and I always just think of him. But yeah, there's a the like I when Jack sees it his friends in trouble after he just yelled at it basically said some pretty awful things. He's like, I'm like, I'm. He basically let him know, like I'm better than you. And I'm like, I don't like my life. It can be better. I choose to do this. And you're just, this is your life. And, but then he sees that he's in trouble and he runs after him. But then there's the sound, the sound of the oil rig as the fight is happening, because the fight is all happening pretty much in silence. It's kind of like you get like the sounds of the like the punching and it's it's funny movie punching, but, it's just heavy machine clanging, just like, like rough metal crunching, fighting silence. And then. And then he walks off like like that's a that's a perfect example of a scene that doesn't actually need to hear the dialog. You could actually just watch that and then get something because and then not know what happened. Because the thing is, is like, we don't know like we don't understand that Elton is committed a crime like a year ago. So we're just as confused. So we even not knowing the information, if it was silent, you'd be like, what the hell just happened anyways? Great. Great scene. I love that I do too. And then you. It's like you describing that lack of sound, but you can hear the machinery. It also reminds me of the fight scene, the beginning of days of Heaven, which I believe one of the Beeb's producers helped produce. There is a days of having connection to these Beeb's guys. I don't have it up. I just remember seeing it. So yeah, it's what I'm saying. These influences, like they're borrowing, they're taking, and of course, you know, a lot of the movies we're going to focus on, we're using influences from European films of the 60s, which we talked about a lot. But yeah, he's meeting I love the scene of him. It's like a minute of him just falling asleep by the fire. That's great imagery, like curled up at home. Yes, I love that. You know, he's he convinces his brother to leave the house so he can woo his fiancee. And then we get the Chopin scene when he plays Chopin for her, and they have to. Great scene. And they have a great, argument after about how he played with no emotion, like she's so moved by it, she's crying and he goes, I didn't play that with any feeling, any emotion, like at all. Yeah, that's really Jack playing too. I didn't. Oh, so I knew that he, practiced for a long time. I didn't know if the notes were actually coming out her feet, so that's that's great. I mean, you can tell that he had absolutely practiced. There's no cutaways. You can tell there's no, like, cutaways close up to his face. They didn't really do that a lot in the 70s. It was all these like master shots. And it's a great scene. And I love the hammer at the end of like that meant nothing to me as the person playing it. There's a really I love knowing this. Apparently Jack is very, very particular about his wardrobe, so. Oh yes, yes, that's right. I remember hearing that about this. Yeah. Yeah. And and there's a scene where when he's asking Catherine when they could hang out, basically, and he's wearing the most flamboyant shirt, like this collared shirt. This orange, yellow and, and and it's so funny because he's wearing it purely just to, like, like to impress her. And and it's just all this. There's nowhere to go. He's in his house, and he's. And she's like, I'll be free in three days. It was all just to get like three days. It is three days it is. And the way the camera's like looking up at her from his POV, he I love that. Yeah, yeah. And then and there's also this scene where he's playing, tabletop tennis with his brother, and he's just making fun of in the way he walks. Yeah. So like, it's so hard. Yeah. He's like, it's so fucked up, dude. Yeah, yeah. And as soon as Carl goes out and he woos. Yeah. The fiance with the music, then we get, you know, a lot of these 70s movies, you're going to have some of the some stuff didn't doesn't translate to 2025. The sexual politics. You know, it's like the way these things go. But he and Catherine, they go at it. And then right after what happens, bam! Especially at shows up via cam and for the terribly awkward dinner where she will stop talking and you're just sit there and you can kind of feel everyone else's amusement of like, oh, look what brother Bobby's been doing. Like kind of lying about this. And it's a great scene. I'm going to do it now because I don't know when we're going to do it. Karen Black just like, amazing. And this, she got her only Oscar nomination for this, and she was nominated for it. She's great. And I love her in it. What? Distinct face, like, what a distinct look she has. And, you know, you're talking. Jack is a young actor in this. This is is this his first starring part? Do we fail to mention that it's his first starring heart in, like, a major, a movie? Not like a. Yeah. In any movie starring part. She is right there with him. She is not taking shit. She's going toe to toe the whole time. And she is remarkable. And it's like you feel sorry for her. That's where the. Oh my God. Yeah. He lies if you feel it. And that's what makes the end such a gut punch, is that we're thinking about her. We're thinking about her condition, the child growing inside of her and how that is being abandoned as well. So I just wanted to put a little boom here for her because she's great. No, you're absolutely right. I mean, to me, she's the heart of the movie. Yeah. Yeah, she is. She is absolutely like the North star of everything. And she just wants love. That's it. Yeah. Like she she's giving it. She's like, she, she is is the epitome of love because she's asking for it. And it's what she gives. And she and she and you can see in every single scene like she cares. Like and she. Yes. Like it's funny because like, one would look at her to be an uneducated human being, but she even when she's talking to the pompous celibate. Yeah. And she and she's sort of like, I, there's some really good stuff on TV. I mean, not all of it's good, but there's some really good stuff. Like I had this and this and this, and it's coming from such a sincere place. Yeah, she's totally sincere. And there is some good stuff on television there. Yeah. Like that's something. She's gonna look down on it. Yeah. She is, she's right. Yeah. It's just. Yeah. And she just means so. Well, and that's part of the tragedy of it is like Jack just can't let her in and and she's just knocking on that door. And I love that we're cutting out at the end. But it's like right before that scene where eventually he leaves the house with her before he takes off with the truck, but she's just kissing him, like in the car and in the car and shoves her. Yeah. And he shoves her and he and she's like, why do you treat me like this? Like. Like I do nothing but do this. Why do you treat me this, this way? It's just it it's so heartbreaking for both of them because I believe, as he has just been told by the unrequited love of Catherine, if a person does not love himself, how can he ask for love in return? Beautiful scene, bro. Beautiful fucking sequence. What? What? Hold up right here. You ready? He's taking a moment. I'm. What are you going to do? Read me exactly what she says. Yes, yes. Quote me a sonnet. Yeah, it was a poem. Is our. Again. Got Shakespeare over here. You're a strange person, Robert. I mean, what would you come to? The person who has no love for himself, the respect for himself, the love of his friends, family, work, something. How can he ask for love in return? I mean, why should he ask for it? Yeah. You selfish fuck. Yeah. And he's. And the only reason he's asking it is because it's just an exit. Like that's my take on it. Like, is she she. He doesn't love Catherine. He doesn't love her. But he met her like, a few hours ago. Practically. Yeah. He doesn't love her, but she's a potential ticket out of his life. And that's what he's looking for. He's looking for his next way out of something, whatever he's in, and he plants these ties, and then he needs to get out of them. But she wants to stay. She just wants to stay in that town. And he keeps telling me all the time he's like, he's like, what? Do you like it here? There's nothing. There's nothing here. And so. And he's so he not only is he trying to like, get her to love him, he's Jake like. And then we leave like, yeah, he's like, wants to change our whole way of life to whatever the hell he thinks he wants. What, are you going to take her to Bakersfield, buddy? Yeah, exactly. The plan. Exactly. She's content on the I mean, the cinematography. Like the colors bouncing off, like the greens and blues. You can see the water. And then his red jacket. It's just. It's brilliant the way the whole things. And close up between them like. Yeah, it's brilliant. And we did kind of skip over the pompous celibate scene. But you know, I love I love what he goes out on. It's Bender because Ray, it's pissed him off so much. So he's Ray. It's pissed him off. Katherine's rejecting him. Get the bender. And then he comes back to the the intellectual snob just sitting there taking everyone down, and. Yeah, he attacks her, which I love. You pompous, celibate. You're totally full of shit. I love that it's love. What? He loses it to her. We left it. Some friends have sent. She got squashed. Platinum. Talk to you right outside their move back home. They do. You see what I mean? The choice of words juxtaposed with the image of the in chapter two words squashed flat, etc., etc.. Yeah, she would that perhaps, but it was just what I was trying to point out. Don't sit there pointing at her. I beg your pardon? I said, don't point at her, you creep. But I was just telling you. Where the hell do you get the ass to tell anybody anything about class, or who the hell's got it, or what she typifies. You shouldn't even be in the same room with her, you pompous celibate. Oh, this is really too much. Calm down. You're totally full of shit. You're all full of shit. And then. Yeah, and you know, he gets in a fight with a male nurse, gets the Spicer fucking Spicer. I love it, I love it, it's so good. It really is. There's one acting moment I want to point out because it's very, very subtle. And I think it's it's a brilliant, brilliant moment. It's around this time of the movie. I actually in this particular scene, I don't think that, Ray has arrived yet. They're having a dinner and Carl, the brother asks Jack, you know, and Catherine asks him to, like, haven't you ever given, like, music? A second thought, yeah. And he and he starts out defensive. He goes, oh, I gave it a second thought. And then he goes into like, talking about a time where he played in Las Vegas for like, you know, like the big, like, showy, like type things. And he starts doing this very, very flamboyant, charismatic dance. He like rips the show. Yeah. Yeah. He's like and he's causing like everyone's having a good time. Like his sister loves it. Like, you see the light in her eyes, she's like, oh, this is my brother right here. And Catherine and Carl are Carl is just sort of like, I'm not gonna stand for this type of behavior and write him and him in Catherine and, like, walk out of the room. And in this moment, Jack is gone from displaying himself in a way of like, trying to be entertaining and fun. He gets rejected by two people, and he literally goes from, like, doing a dance number to being embarrassed, to looking to his sister who's like there for him. And then he gets angry and you watch this all happen in about 10s and he's not even making a big deal of it, but it's just the, the human emotion of like, oh, I'm that didn't go my way. Like, that's weird. He even has memory moments. Looks there he goes, that's on them. Right. And then just goes into there and then it's just embarrassed and then anger and he storms right out. It's just fucking brilliant to watch. Like, again, it's something you plan, you know, it's not like he has an actor like you or like, all right, I'll do this in this moment. That's just that's just him being in his emotional life. And let it going. It's amazing. God, I love Jack so much. I know that scene exactly that you're talking about. And you can see, like, the trust that his good friend who's directing the movie, the trust that he gets, like, even when he's flipping out the car before they start the road trip. Yeah. In the commentary, Rafelson said, this is just Jack. We knew we had to flip out, and you let him do what he does, and he does that, and then that's it. I think that was shot at one time. Yeah, yeah. There's one take. Yep. Yeah. Yep. And you know, that's a good director knows when to step aside. That is part of the thing to step aside and let magic happen over there. Yeah. Basically you know we we touched on the end when about an hour ago. But I know we're leading up to the end where they leave and she's all over him. Kissing him affectionately pushes her away. And then, yeah, they stop at the little, you know, the road, the truck stop to get gas and sends her inside to get some food. And he makes the decision to head off to parts unknown. Who knows? Who knows where the story goes, but it is so evocative. That final shot, those final few shots like the mere but just the final one of the credits, the, you know, the original ending was, yes, because this is why the may maybe why the writer wanted her name taken off of it, which she did sometimes, but yeah, tell me what the original was. So like her original ending because, and Bob Rafelson talks about how he credits most of this movie, like in the writing to her. I forget her name. Carol was. Yeah. She it's it's it's hard to keep track of because she changed it. So she's credited as Adrian Joyce, but I believe her real name is Carol Eastman. Yeah. So it was it was this thing. She was this great writer. But then often, not just on this movie, often decided to not take credit and to take credit as a pseudonym. So, yeah, that's what she did here. And so Rafelson is like that. Most of the magic of this movie in the writing comes from her. But the ending that she originally had, Rafelson hated it. And he honestly, it was the right call, because if this movie ended this way, it wouldn't be. I don't think what it is. It was originally going to be when Rhett and Jack are driving back. Basically the car crashes, like in some sort of way, like they end up in a car crash and they die too easy and. Yeah, and yeah, and it and it doesn't leave you with anything. Like if you actually get the endings that you get no ambiguity. None yet. And, and and it just it's it's. Yeah. And it's just literally dead and so I don't know how you go from having an ending that's just, quite frankly, not very good to then finding an ending. That is, that's one of the most powerful endings to any movie ever. Like, that's I, I don't know what that process was, like, but I would have loved to have kind of that would be my one question for for Rafelson. If I could ask you, how did you go from that to this? It's a smart move to abandon that ending because, it's part of what made Easy Rider stick out so much. The year before was the ending and the finality and the lack of ambiguity of that ending and how shocking it is. And you're like, Jesus Christ. So, yeah, the ending of Five Easy Pieces we both obviously fully endorse. And you're, you know, if you're watching the movie, expect if you haven't seen and you're expecting some big like, whoa thing, I mean, this thing's 98 minutes long, but I'm telling you, if you sit with it, put the phone away and it leads to those final shots, it it will make you think. And you're going to sit there and have a relationship with the movie long after it ends. And I love that. It's one of the reasons, you know, wow, at the end, it's one of the reasons why the movie lives on. It has the diner scene that, like, helps it get into this is like ice, but the movie has to win on its own merits. Like, yeah, you know, it still has to be good to stand on its own. And it's nice to go. Yeah. You know, that really famous diner scene or the whole damn movie is really good too, if you go check it out. So, yeah. So that's kind of running through the movie. Now we get to do something really fun. We're going to do something for every one of these new Hollywood film project movies, the new Hollywood categories, I've come up seven, seven categories. These aren't set in stone. They may change. Maybe. I don't know if we'll even do them at this place in every episode, but and not all the categories are, you know, reinventing the wheel. They're kind of some of some of them are obvious. But I thought if there, you know, there's stuff we haven't talked about, whatever it is we're going to do some categories here. I'll explain them as we go. But first off, because we're focusing on new Hollywood movies, what is your favorite thing about Five Easy Pieces that makes it a new Hollywood movie? And just to explain briefly, it's like I said in American movies prior to 1967, you could not have you couldn't have language, nudity, sex, violence. There's so much you couldn't have. So you can look at New Hollywood that way, that the rating systems in place, you can look at it with the director, the actor, anything. Just what whatever it is. And I can answer first you. It's up to you, I think. And I'll answer first. I'll take the week. Okay. All right. Sure. Yeah. Take the weight. I care about the fucking questions. I think in answering just this specific question, what makes this a new Hollywood movie? It has to be the ending. Oh, yeah. For everything. Yeah. For having the balls to be that ambiguous with it, but then also leave it to where it is the protagonist anti-hero who makes a choice. That's not good. And like, because ultimately, like there is no redemption. We don't we don't come full circle with this guy to end a movie, even if it even if it wasn't that ending, but you still want to leave with that ambiguity is still a ballsy move. You didn't see. It just so happens that you accomplish that and give a ending that punches you in the face. So I think it has to be the ending. I had the exact same thing I said. The anonymity of his journey after the movie ends, which we already kind of talked about. I kind of had a second runner up, which was, his. Nicholson's lack of likability is a very new Hollywood thing of like, we're never really going to give you a reason to like this guy, like we're not. So here's your movie. And that that informs the ending. So yeah, where I agree, I agree. Yeah. All right. Second category is this Bob Rafelson best movie I think so of of whatever you've seen. I said yes as well. I do think this is his best. My number, my second one would be head because I loved it. And the number three third favorite, Bob Reeves and films movie you have to see called Stay Hungry. Oh my God, you're talking young, young Arnold Schwarzenegger working out at a gym. And oh my God, Jeff Bridges, like you would love this thing leads to a terrifying conclusion I loved it. It's not part of PBS, but you would love it. That'd be my number three. But yeah, good. Good director. Worked with Nicholson a lot. Okay. Is this the actors best performance? And if not, where does it rank? So I said I'll go first. I said, no, this is not Jack's best performance, but it is his best performance up until 1970. So it wasn't like give me watch pieces. Yeah. What? He was an easy rider. He got nominated for another rider. So what? So what? How many other times was Mikey Madison nominated? Zero. I'm just saying. Yeah, he got them. All right, all right, all right. You know what? You don't have to bash my low hanging fruit. We're supposed to be supporting here. So where does it rank? Like it's. I would call this a more like this is a, I think, a softer jack with explosive elements where some of his performances live in explosion and you get some softer moments. This is one where. But but he's not like his charm comes from a place of intelligence and a place of arrogance. And he again is not the most likable guy. He's charming. So. But yeah, I don't think it's Jack's best, necessarily. Oh, this is such a hard question. This is. No it's not. Yes, it is. Okay. I'm going. I, I will say I don't think like it's nothing. No, it's not I, I wouldn't be my number one. But where does it rank for him? I think it top five. Oh. Top three. Top three. Yeah. Okay. Well top three is because you've you've already said you have to. If you're talking about Jack top five, you have to have The Shining in there to your words. And you said, as good as it gets would be to top it, I did. So that's two. So then top three is tricky because, because you have Chinatown, Cuckoo's Nest, last detail and Five Easy Pieces, and those are just my personal favorites and that's for you. You only have three spots left, motherfucker. I think if I had to, you can reordered. You're allowed. You're allowed. All right, as of as of this episode, this, I think number one would be Cuckoo's Nest. Cool. Two would be Easy Rider. Wait, what? Yeah. Two. Yeah. Yeah. Two. Fuck! Are you giving me so much? Dude, you're an asshole. I just said five. I said five. Easy pieces. You're supposed to be supporting me. Was his best performance up until then. And you're like, well, yeah. Oh. Oh, I know what. No question. You don't even agree with that statement. That was a long time ago. That was 35 seconds ago. He's asking a question from a half hour ago. You're supposed. We're supposed to say something that Easy Rider two. Okay, easy rider two. So what's three? Five easy pieces. And then four is as good as it gets. I mean, I'm thinking maybe I'm taking that one out. Okay, okay, okay, I think so. That's fair. I like detail it for you. Well. Hum. It's really The Witches of Eastwick is right there. I'm just saying, it's a great movie. I love that movie plays the devil. Do you know what's really nice about Jack in that movie? He, He would show up every day. Even when he wasn't. Don't stop was supposed to be shooting. Oh, yeah? Why do you even show up every day when he was supposed to be shooting? And he likes to do that? Yeah, yeah. And he would help the other actors if they were reading lines where he would say their lines to give them something. Yeah. Like that's, that's a, that's a, that's a winning move from a, from a lead person. That's a dude with the mentality who was busting his ass for ten years in Hollywood and not getting anywhere. And it's the same thing with A Few Good Men. He still was delivering from the. They did his coverage first. You can aren't you can't handle the truth. Then he sat there all fucking day for everyone else's coverage until they had to cut him. And yeah, he's like, I love acting. I'm not going to have anyone else do it. But that's that's all right. We'll, we'll we'll discuss top five Jack later. You're still later. We're not even done with the categories number four. Oh, what happened to that number four. What happened to them? You know what I mean. Sometimes you're watching these movies and there's, you see Frank from cliffhanger, or you see someone and you're like, oh, yeah, what happened to them? Or in my case, I pick Susan and Spar as Catherine, so I never really saw her again. I recently watched misunderstood in my Gene Hackman binge. She had a small role. She was in Hal Ashby's first film, The Landlord, which I still haven't seen, but otherwise, I've never seen this woman in something else. And I thought, she's really good in this movie. Her? Yeah, kind of, patient, articulate telling off of Jack, which you read to me while looking in my eyes just now. It's very good and it she deserves, I think, more of a career because of that. But I just thought the whole time in my research watching this movie, I'm like, that was what I saw. What happened to her? That's so. Well, in the commentary. Rafelson says that she should have had a better career for herself, but apparently she was very particular. And, and I guess that like it. That's what cast her that that was the. That was the impression that I got from his his, commentary about it. Yeah. You can't say no to everything. Like, you have to accept some roles. So yeah, that was that was definitely a thing that made it, I don't know, probably a little hard for. Who did you pick, though, for this. For what happened, did I pick oh what happened to them? It would be. It would be, the sister, the twister. Oh. Lo Smith. Lewis Smith. Yeah. She had a decent career, though. She was in a lie. She did. But, yeah, I love her so much. So I sort of kind of look at this question and be like, almost like, well, what else has she done? So I can see it? Her first film was East of Eden. I think I, reference that on our Twister Twisters plot, but that's really cool. Yeah. I mean, yeah, Fatal Attraction. Yeah. Midnight run. Yeah. I mean, she had she was a great, character actor in Minority Report. Yeah, I remember her net. All right. Oh. Number five. That's right. You can pick, favorite scene or favorite shot. And for me, you know, either or. I think the most iconic scene is a diner scene. But my favorite shot is literally the final shot, which I think tells a feature length story. Yeah, I love that shot. I it's it's both. Yeah. It's again, it goes back to the ending. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's just that it's, it's it's just that good. Number six, you kind of already spoiled yours. But it's favorite quote. And again some of these are going to be more obvious and others maybe. But let me get mine out. Where do you get the ass to tell anybody anything about class or who the hell's got it or what she typifies. You shouldn't even be in the same room with her. You pop it celibate. You're totally full of shit. You're all full of shit. Great life. Okay, that's that's that's a that's a I want you to put it between your knees is also a very, very good line. But, yes, I love, I love the whole what he tells her off, I love it. I, the line that I gave for you from Catherine is not my favorite line of the movie. My favorite line is actually. Well, it's like it's it's it's it's the whole we never even talked about it, which is great to bring it up. Now, it's the scene where he has with his father. Oh, yes. That's right. We breezed right over that. His his confession to the one man, to the one person who cannot talk back. Yep. Exactly. And, and it's a great story behind that scene because they knew that they, like, technically speaking, needed to wanted to have Jack Nicholson's character cry at one point, and they were trying to figure out where they were going to do it. And Bob is like, you have three scenes left, you got to cry. And one of them see it, pick it, because Jack didn't want to just do that. And so, like, they set it up. But, Rafelson moved the crew out like he was sort of like. And he held the boom, but he didn't even watch the scene because he was like, holding the boom. And he was like, I'm turning my back. So Jack could just be alone and do this. So there was no crew watching. It was just Jack and the actor playing the father, and Jack just fucking lays this down and, and and and and and but Bob is like, there's like a pause and he's like, are you done, Jack? And he goes, Jack goes, what the fuck do you mean? You didn't even see it. You didn't even watch it. But the quote that I like is, I won't read the whole entire thing is it's just a great scene is it's basically a monologue. But, my life, most of it doesn't add up to much that I could relate as a way of life that you'd approve of. I move around a lot. Not because I'm looking for anything, really, but because I'm getting away from the things that get bad. If I stay true. Love it. Love is fucking fucking great, man. I mean, that's he sums himself up like that. That lines, he sums it up for himself. And then Katherine's line to him is what sums him up to. Yeah. That character. Yeah, yeah. Our final category, category number seven, is something I've been wanted to do for a long time. It's called the. What are you watching Nick don't still hot take because occasionally it's not all the time I am served some radical al out of fucking left field hot takes from Nick toadstool. Sometimes I don't even include them on the podcast because they are reaches and they are stretches. Other times they cause good debate. So what I'm doing is putting a designated space for the wide end that you can drop. It's right here, so you can save it and you can drop it. This hot take can can include anything. Doesn't matter. It is your hot take. It's your world. I don't necessarily have to agree with it. It can be an opinion. It can be anything you want. But you're going to have it for every single new Hollywood project film that we cover. So what is the coveted what are you watching, Nick? Those still hot take for the Five Easy Pieces episode, and this is a good one. I have to say, I can't. I can't guarantee if I'm if all of my hot takes because like because trying to find one, you know, so so as we go on, I can't promise that they're all going to be good. But this one you already had, I, I you're easy rider is Nicholson second best performance is a hot fire. It's a hot take. Yeah it's a hot take. But this is just this just applies to this movie fair. All right, stay with me right now, okay? I don't know if when you watch this movie from start to finish, I honestly question whether or not we become as emotionally invested into the movie. If we don't have the opening scene or the opening song, Stand by Your Man by Tammy Wynette. Because. And the reason I say this is because I watched this movie twice in a row in preparing for the pod, once with the commentary and once just watching it. Now, the lyrics that are happening in that song are from my take on it is that's actually red, because like, there's a lines like it's because it's sometimes it's hard to be, sometimes it's hard to be a woman because you have to deal with this guy. That's basically I mean, that's a terrible paraphrase, but the song posits this idea that it's like, it's really hard to love somebody like this, but I stand by your man and we don't know anything about the movie. We're watching an oil rig. We're watching up Jack Nicholson. Isn't that a single word? But we have at a place where this movie is coming from that I understand because I'm actually now thinking about Ray. Yet I like I'm thinking, so then when we see Jack and he starts behaving, I'm immediately thinking about the song. And when the time that I watched it in the commentary was on, he was talking. And then we're rolling past through the song, and now we're in that scene and Jack Nicholson's just become an asshole, and there's no actual weight that's here. It's just like there's nothing I can anchor to. So I think this song by Tammy Wynette anchors the movie before it even goes in a place where I'm emotionally open to this guy, or it's a great take of what he gives. Yes, that's that's my take. Pay as much attention to the song, which, yeah, the little context of the song, I like it. I didn't know where you were going. That's great. That's great. Good job. You. Thank you. The way in the making it thing. You've seized it. Great job. I see the car touch on. Yes. Okay. Other things. Those are categories. The first round of our categories. If you have other ones, always feel free to submit them to us at Wawa underscore podcast anywhere we'll consider them. Talked about everything else that I want to talk about. We can do the got nominated for four Oscars. I just don't know how many of the others you've seen. So I don't know if we want to go like, oh, I should've won this, but don't be patronizing. Oh, Nick, I know you haven't seen a lot of the other nominees, so we don't have to do them if you don't want to. That's patronizing. Okay. Can't nominated for for goddamn picture. Picture director actor and supporting actress. Supporting actress actually got brought up on our live stream record before the most recent Oscars because someone said, you know, the longest gap between Oscar like the same person winning an Oscar. And I was trying to remember, I'm like, someone won for airport. They also won in the 30s, and my dad came in on the chat. Helen Hayes won for airport in 1970. Karen Black was nominated for five Easy Pieces. Lee Grant, who I love, was nominated for the landlord, already mentioned that I got to see it, Sally Kellerman for Mash and Maureen Stapleton for airport. I don't know if you've seen airport. I'm not trying to be patronizing. No, he hasn't. So my guess is you would have Karen Black win this, which is the only performance you've likely seen. No, you've seen Mash thousand percent. You're right. You're right on all fronts. Best actor George C okay George C Scott wins for Patton. Great award Melvin Douglas for I never sang for my father, which I just watched for the first time as part of my Hackman binge. James Earl Jones for the Great White Hope. He's great that Nicholson gets nominated for Five Easy Pieces and Ryan O'Neal. Love means never having to say you are sorry for the love story. Jesus Christ, it's a long title. No, it's called Love Story. I added that in oh, I'm sorry, what? The famous quote from Love Stories. Love means never having to say you're sorry. No, the name is love story. I told you there. Didn't know. Oh, man, that's a that's a hell of a line. Oh, yeah. That's like the whole ethos of the movie, but it's bullshit. That's bullshit. That's that's that. That's. You're always apologizing. Goddamn right you are. Sorry. I put myself in this situation, so I would love for you to see Peyton, because it's. It's a really good movie. But this is, you know, the Oscars went back to, like, the traditional big studio movie after giving it to Midnight Cowboy the year before. So George C Scott wins that. It's a fair Oscar. Director Franklin J. Schaffner wins for Patton. Fellini was nominated for Fellini's Satyricon, probably saying that wrong or Arthur Hiller for Love Story, Robert Altman for Mash, Ken Russell Women in Love. Wait a minute. There's no five easy pieces there, nerd. I must have done something wrong. I'm going to skip that. I thought it said he got nominated for. He only got three Oscar nominations. Oh, it's screenplay, not director, you fucking idiot. So. Okay, they lost that too. All right, moving on to picture Jesus Christ, I try picture patent wins. Airports nominated five easy pieces love story and mash patent wins. I'm just going through real quick. I know everyone comes here for knowledge. Sorry it wasn't director, it was screenplay. You know, the most recent winner of Best Original Screenplay, Sean Baker for. No. That's right. Goddamn right. Trivia. When did you learn what Five Easy Pieces refers to? A week ago. Yeah. Same here, same here? Yeah. I guess, refers to a book of piano lessons for beginners. Makes total sense. It would you? It's thought you said context. So that was. I love the title that that's thing. I need to see what the reference is. I gotta love this title, but I don't know what the hell it means. It's like five. Like, is is this movie broken up in like five ideas maybe. Yeah. No, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a practicing book for piano which makes complete sense. So really does what are you watching? We've made it through five easy pieces. This is great. This is like the vibe and the tone that I want these episodes taken. Just please, people go see this like it is, God, it has some standout moments and you get to this end. That is so worth it. So I really. Yeah, I highly recommend Five Easy Pieces and Rafelson other films. Yeah, I, I, this movie is meant a lot to me. Upon the rediscovering it for the first time a few months ago, like, after going, like, 20 years, maybe without. Yeah. It's me. Yeah. You know, and, and now, like, now when I go back to the beginning of this part and I think about those creatives that I was hearing talk about this movie and holding it in such regard, I now feel that way about this, like it's this movie is like it almost has felt like a therapy session watching this movie and in so many ways. So I love that. Nice. What are you watching? What do we got? You're going first. Well, I'm going with the Jack movie. All right. Oh are you. I watched a few for this to. I'll have you know. Yeah, I'm going with a weird one. Okay. And it's one that my mom despises. Jack Nicholson, because of this movie. Oh, I see that she's not a Jack fan in general. Carnal knowledge. Carnal. Oh, I just I can. What the fuck? I love that movie. Come on. Now, I know I like Nichols and very hard movie to find. I wanted to rewatch it for this episode. It is some, for some reason, nowhere even. It's only available on DVD. I don't think there's a Blu-ray of it and it's like, can't even rent it on like YouTube. It's nowhere, but I it is one of my favorite Mike Nichols movies. I love this, this is a great rec. It's really great. It's, it's it's it's a, it's a, it's a fucked up movie because these are for people that are not good to each other. It's it's it's even more like diabolical in that way than closer in some ways. Because it's like more clearly. Yeah. Taking a huge right I mean, closer feels like a like kind of follow up to Carnal Knowledge. I think it does. Same. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. But the what the, the way that these people treat each other is just so much dirtier and, and, and, but it really is something to watch. I love this movie. That's great if you can find it. Yeah. I mean, I genuinely almost bought it. I wouldn't if that's on Blu ray or 4K, I'll definitely buy it. And then it wasn't anywhere. So yeah, go check out Carnal Knowledge if you can find it. Oh it's vicious. I went with one we've already talked about. I was trying to think of a Rafelson film, and the one I did love, Stay Hungry, but head was absolutely hysterical. It is absurdist on purpose. They are. It's at times looking into the camera and going, this doesn't work. And according to Ravel Center, he had the idea of the Monkees TV show. He just he didn't know it was going to be the monkeys. He didn't even know who the band was going to be before A Hard Day's Night came out. So it's so cool that he had this idea at the same time. And the Monkees TV show, if you saw that Ever had, is kind of an extension of that. But it is outrageous. It is very short. It's on YouTube, it's very easy to find, and I loved it. So please go check that out, especially if you love the music of The Monkees as much as I do. This is fun. It's a lot of fun to research this one, too. I loved watching all the Rafelson stuff early. Jack, let us know what you're thinking about the project, about Five Easy Pieces. What categories we should do at White Underscore podcast. But as always, thanks for listening and happy watching. Here we come. Walk down the street. We get funniest looks from everyone we meet. Hey, we're the monkeys. And people say we monkey around. But we're too busy singing to put everybody down. Hey everyone, thanks again for listening. Send us mailbag questions at What Are You Watching podcast at gmail.com or find us on Twitter, Instagram and Letterboxd at. We w underscore podcast next time. Is it safe? Go watch John Schlesinger's marathon man. This is one of my favorite films of the 70s. I love this movie and it is next for the New Hollywood Film Project. Stay tuned. Oh. Anytime or anywhere. Just look over your shoulder. Guess who was standing there. Hey, hey, with the monkeys. I said we monkey around. We're too busy singing to put anybody down. Why? What's up? Hey, Mack. Shut up!